[djmerlyn]

Its tough to find a system that is going to make everyone happy. Processors charge fees, its not cheap to make money. You get hit with processor fees, transaction fees, taxes, etc. I can't think of any place that really hits home for a small independent site with low priced transactions and low volume. You kinda have to start looking at, are you charging as much as you should? And, how can you increase sales volume? To make the numbers work. Online commerce sucks like that. I'd probably go back to looking at the business model and see if it actually makes sense, a lot of times it doesn't.


_________________
Pro JR Hosting, now 50% off!
-100% Guaranteed

"more server and network power than any host, dedicated to your jamroom site"

[b360]

The only reason for use of PayPalPro paid services for commerce would be to take advantage of "Virtual Terminal Payments" and to lower transaction fees on high ticket items.

Otherwise the standardard (Free) is the proper set up for websites like Jamroom doing Ecommerce selling micro payments of a .99 download, 7.99 album or a 9.99 tshirt. If any items are over $12 a .30cent transaction fee applies.
This is why they created this option (Micro Payments).

Jamroom wont be handeling "Virtual Terminal Payments" As far as I can see.

The standard Paypal structure can handle all types of transactions necessary, so I don't understand why you might be suggesting use of pro.

Depending on how your site is set up to pay out I can see where it may apply considering how much and how often you pay out to the artists/bands selling on your sight however regardless of how you look at it the fees are attached to the company providing the transaction service based on client needs.

I think a very good point the customers have made here would be why have an open source software, yet a 3rd party companys attached to it charging and overseeing services and fees.

Theres plenty of other open source and free alternatives which are set up to do exactly what is needed here. I have already provided a great one to you folks.

In essence that would be like Linux being free and open source yet to host any webpage you need to pay the people who wrote "terminal script" $5 each website. How far would Linux be with that option bound to those ties.

[Brian]

OpenCart is a pretty nice setup, but it does not support recurring (subscriptions) or "touch" billing (i.e. rebilling without the physical card present). It also only supports 20 gateways versus foxycart's 60.

I'm a huge fan of Open Source, but if we encountered an issue in opencart there is no guarantee it would be fixed, nor any assurance a developer would even look at it. With FoxyCart it would be fixed quickly.

Again - I understand some people are not sold on FoxyCart and don't want to go that route - but that does not mean we're going to build an alternative. SteveX has already hinted at working on an alternate, so if there is demand for an alternate solution, one will likely come up very quickly.

Thanks!

- Brian


_________________
Make sure and check out:
* The Jamroom FAQ
* The Jamroom Documentation

[Brian]

Actually to add - it would be really easy to add opencart to a Jamroom system - it would of course be "external" but could be integrated by a knowledgeable dev fairly easily, so I'd recommend checking it out.

Hope this helps!

- Brian


_________________
Make sure and check out:
* The Jamroom FAQ
* The Jamroom Documentation

[b360]

Yes, you would want to have a look at this to intergrate it easily to Jamroom and it could be internally.
http://www.opencart.com/index.php?route=extension/extension/info&extension_id=917

Thanks for looking in to this Brian!

[SteveX]

b360:

Yes, you would want to have a look at this to intergrate it easily to Jamroom and it could be internally. http://www.opencart.com/index.php?route=extension/extension/info&extension_id=917

Go for it b360, it will only cost you $60 to try.


_________________
Kulshi Mezian!

"Stranger from another planet, welcome to our hole. Just strap on your guitar and we'll play some rock and roll"

Ultrabubble create things.

[b360]

Im going to purchase a license and attempt to help the community out. Ive got phpstorm set up on a demo site now but I still have to pick apart and learn the structure of the Jamroom system as im new to it and how it ties together and works. Theres no docs available yet to speed me up so im limited to form posts for now.

Im coming from a strong c#, networking, and various other skill sets and now picking up PHP fast so I should be able to adapt fairly quickly.

[Brian]

b360:

Im going to purchase a license and attempt to help the community out. Ive got phpstorm set up on a demo site now but I still have to pick apart and learn the structure of the Jamroom system as im new to it and how it ties together and works. Theres no docs available yet to speed me up so im limited to form posts for now. Im coming from a strong c#, networking, and various other skill sets and now picking up PHP fast so I should be able to adapt fairly quickly.

That's awesome We are actively working on the documentation as we speak - we're not ready to move to the new website at this time, but as we get close we'll start providing links to get feedback. If you can just hang in there for another week or two, it's coming real soon.

Thanks!

- Brian


_________________
Make sure and check out:
* The Jamroom FAQ
* The Jamroom Documentation

[SteveX]

b360:

Im going to purchase a license and attempt to help the community out.

You should probably contact Justin (the developer of that opencart extension) and check what sort of license he'd be able to provide you with.


_________________
Kulshi Mezian!

"Stranger from another planet, welcome to our hole. Just strap on your guitar and we'll play some rock and roll"

Ultrabubble create things.

[b360]

Brian:

That's awesome We are actively working on the documentation as we speak - we're not ready to move to the new website at this time, but as we get close we'll start providing links to get feedback. If you can just hang in there for another week or two, it's coming real soon.

Sounds great!... Its been a ruff start today but I have achieved great success. I have started the intergration and set up the module. Have invested hours in reading over your code to learn how it works... but its slowly coming along.

[Ken Rich]

Brian:

The important thing here is that there is a different mindset between you and your users when you run your site as a business versus running your site as a hobby:

I have looked at your point of view and that of Michael in this thread, but I think you are both leaving out an inconvenient truth. Very few people will ever recoup their investment in Jamroom, or operate a successful music business.

In fact, very few people in the music industry at large, can make a go of it, whether they are a band, a radio station, or a music sales outlet. I know artists with world class albums who have spent thousands on advertising and are in every major outlet, but they can't make sales. They have done everything "right", but not many people buy music now-a-days. There is a "GLUT" of free music in every genre available from bit torrent and share sites.

To have to pay $20. a month just to leave open the remote possibility of sales, is not a workable model for most people operating Jamroom sites. Like it or not, we are in competition with i-tunes, CD Baby's mega distribution pack, ReverbNation, and every other professionally run music site. We are fighting them for sales in an environment where music doesn't sell well, and most owners will simply not make $20 in profit a month to pay for their Foxy cart, or ever recoup their investment in Jamroom software.

While I am sure there are exceptions, I would think the vast majority of Jamroom sites are "wanna be" successful sites, but end up hobby sites by "default". It is a "pipe dream" to think it will become anything but that for most owners, due to the nature of the industry.

In light of that fact, I think a shopping cart solution that caters to the needs your actual client base would be in order. Built for those who live with the harsh realities of the music scene, rather than one that caters to the elite few who somehow manage to run a profitable site, or the delusional who think they are sitting on the next i-tunes.

I would agree with you that "Foxy Cart" is "the bomb" for those who can afford it, and that it solves a multitude of programming difficulties for you in one fell swoop. I think it is an excellent option to have available, but Jamroom 5 needs a "poor man's" cart as it's default, with the option to upgrade.

Just my opinion, for what it's worth.


_________________
Ken

[izasha]

Izhmel was right. Does jamroom block or delete users that make valid arguments, such as Izhmel? haven't heard from him in while, i hope you take his advice and incorporate paypal back in jr5...here in the UK, we have never heard of Foxycart and don't use it - paypal is very much the platform to use....i don't understand why foxycart can't be optional?

[Dazed]

izasha:

Izhmel was right. Does jamroom block or delete users that make valid arguments, such as Izhmel? haven't heard from him in while, i hope you take his advice and incorporate paypal back in jr5...here in the UK, we have never heard of Foxycart and don't use it - paypal is very much the platform to use....i don't understand why foxycart can't be optional?

I thought Izhmel finally decided to build his own site to his own specs because no one here knew what they were doing.

As for him being right, many countries have gone to war because they thought they were right. That statement is pretty subjective.

[izasha]

I noticed after Izhmel first spoke about foxy cart the only people who don't agree with him are developers and you Dazed, you seems like you are seeking friends from the JR team, I agree with him foxy cart will kill JR5, I read all the treads about foxy cart and every one who invested in JR4 don't like foxy cart and wants pay pal, here in the UK every one knows pay pal, and no one knows foxy cart . no one wants to pay $20 a month just in case there is a sale and is why most people is switching back to JR4 , foxy cart will kill JR5

[SteveX]

Iz, I'm in the UK at the moment and I know about foxycart.


_________________
Kulshi Mezian!

"Stranger from another planet, welcome to our hole. Just strap on your guitar and we'll play some rock and roll"

Ultrabubble create things.